ਪ੍ਰਥਮਰਹਿਤਯਹਿਜਾਨਖੰਡੇਕੀਪਾਹੁਲਛਕੇ॥ ਸੋਈਸਿੰਘਪ੍ਰਧਾਨਅਵਰਨਪਾਹੁਲਜੋਲਏ॥

Akal Purakh Kee Rachha Hamnai, SarbLoh Dee Racchia Hamanai


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Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: yes (IP Logged)
Date: January 22, 2008 08:15AM

What was Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Ji's view on:

- the Mool Mantar

- start and finish of Rehras Sahib

- socialising with non-Amritdharis and non-Sikhs (Gurmat view on this as well)

- converting non-Sikhs into Sikhi (Gurmat view on this as well)

Dhanvad.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Harinder Singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 22, 2008 11:19PM

<<socialising with non-Amritdharis and non-Sikhs (Gurmat view on this as well)

- converting non-Sikhs into Sikhi (Gurmat view on this as well) >>

From my limited undestanding of gurmat, A true sikh is the dust of everyone's feet and helps all including non-sikhs but this is done by remaining niaara. THe first and foremost requirement for remaining niaara is to limit roti and beti de sanj with fellow sikhs only. Other than this, one shud do sangat or have company of people who japp naam. IN daily ardaas we say "sayee pyare maill jinnaa miliyaan tera naam chitt aave."
INfact, personally I dont even like to do much sangat of amritdharis who dont japp naam and just waste their's and others time marring gallan baataan.In short, a gursikh shud only do sangat of Naam or people who can bring him closer to Naam. "bin navai ko belli naahee"

Regarding converting non-sikhs into sikhi, well this shud not be on the mind of a gursikh.However a gursikh shud do parchar of sikhi to people who are seeking parchar.Just random talking about gursikhi with strangers who dont want parchar, well its just ridiculous.The key is naam, if one has zabardast naam kamayee, well that person will automatically convert people into sikhi or make kache sikhs more pakkee.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: kulbir singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 23, 2008 07:13AM

-----
- the Mool Mantar
-------

As far as I know, Bhai Sahib believed in Mool Mantr till Gurprasaad.


-------
- start and finish of Rehras Sahib
-------

Not sure what Rehraas Sahib Bhai Sahib did. I assume he must have been doing what Jatha Singhs do i.e. the Panthak Rehraas Sahib.


--------
- socialising with non-Amritdharis and non-Sikhs (Gurmat view on this as well)
---------

Bhai Sahib was of the opinion that a Gursikh should socialize with Gursikhs only. Many pankitis can be given in support of this stand. Here is one pankiti:


mnmuK sau kir dosqI suK ik puCih imq ]






manamukh so kar dhosathee sukh k pushhehi mith ||

If you make friends with the self-willed manmukhs, O friend, who can you ask for peace?



gurmuK sau kir dosqI siqgur sau lwie icqu ]






guramukh so kar dhosathee sathigur so laae chith ||

Make friends with the Gurmukhs, and focus your consciousness on the True Guru.

--------
- converting non-Sikhs into Sikhi (Gurmat view on this as well)
--------

I know Bhai Sahib has done extensive parchaar of Gursikh by doing kirtan, and writing books. He has written about future time, when in the whole world there will be Khalsa Raj and he writes that there will be 'jhunda de jhund' (great groups) of Rehitvaan Sarblohi Khalsa all over the world.


Kulbir Singh

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: 00Singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 23, 2008 09:03AM

Sorry, what is the issue with Rehras Sahib's ending?

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: khalistan_zindabaad (IP Logged)
Date: January 23, 2008 09:05AM

is there any eveidence to support your claims . . .i.e. from any of bhai sahib books, or are you just assuming?

thank you

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Anonymous User (IP Logged)
Date: January 23, 2008 12:59PM

"A true sikh is the dust of everyone's feet..."

Harinder Singh, where did you pick this crap from?. Only place i can think of is ISKCON. So, by any chance were you a HK guy or you are born Sikh?.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: csingh (IP Logged)
Date: January 23, 2008 01:02PM

I can imagine people like Mr khalstan Zindabad now make up fake stories of Bhai sahib doing taksali rehras, just like they made up the raagmala one.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: yes (IP Logged)
Date: January 23, 2008 03:17PM

Thank you for all your replies.

1. In regards to Mool Mantar, how does one go about deciding which one is the correct one, till now I have been doing up till Gurprasad but the older sampardas do till Nanak hosee bhee sach... because of this I do both Mool Mantars as I dont know which one we are supposed to do... HELP!

2. In regards to socialising with non-Amritdharis, would it be considered against Gurmat if we are preaching to Sikhs to follow the Guru's path even though they do not do Naam Simran?

3. Would it be going against Akal Takhat Maryada if we read more than the Panthic one? i.e start at har jug jug bhagat opaya....


Thanks again! :D

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Harinder Singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 02:52AM

<<Harinder Singh, where did you pick this crap from?. Only place i can think of is ISKCON. So, by any chance were you a HK guy or you are born Sikh?>>

Dear Chandra Singh, Honestly I dint even know whats iskcon.just opened their website. I have no enemity with HK people but I dont folow any mattt other than Gurmat.For me gurmatt is the only complete and pure matt and by saying I am not offending any other matt, its within my rights to have this belief.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Abhiyaasee (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 03:43AM

veerjeeo daas thinks it's even better reading more baani than anyone claims to do. if bhai sahib didn't read har jugjug bhagat upayaa.... than i think it shouldn't make a difference to us. daas has a gutkaa printed by taksal and harjugjug.. is wirtten in it so i memorized it and read it always. the extensive baani we read the more laahaa the more kamaayee we gain .i hope u got me.


if i'm wrong then please correct me.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: 00Singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 04:45AM

Sorry I'm confused, where should Rehras Sahib end?

For me i've been told to do it until Tis Sahib ki tek Nanak Mane Maye, Jis Simirat sukh hoe, sagle dookh jae. Also within the Rehras, the chaupai sahib is up to and including Arril and Swaye and Dohra.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: khalistan_zindabaad (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 05:38AM

in history a longer version of rehraas sahib was done than that done by jatha and panth today.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Anonymous User (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 08:03AM

"Honestly I dint even know whats iskcon.just opened their website."

trnad api sunicena taror api sahisnuna
amanina manadena kirtaniya sada harih

["Thinking oneself to be even lower and more worthless than insignificant grass which has been trampled beneath everyone's feet, being more tolerant than a tree, being prideless, and offering respect to all others according to their respective positions, one should continuously chant the holy name of Sri Hari." (Sri Siksastakam, verse 3)

[www.vnn.org]

My question was how being a Sikh you picked this perversion of bhakti?. Sikhs are not supposed to think like that.


"For me gurmatt is the only complete and pure matt and by saying I am not offending any other matt, its within my rights to have this belief..."

A true Sikh will say that for me ( as per my Dharma) gurmatt is best for me. What you wrote is insulting and negating for others, possesing the strains of Abrahamism. Who would have judged by seeing the essenes and the gnostics and the early Christians of the roman empire that one day Christianity will drown theworld
with blood and erase entire civilizations?

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Anonymous User (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 08:16AM

"I am not offending any other matt"


"hurting my sentimenmts" is always the last resort of those who have nothing
to substantiate or defend themsleves with. and so the muslims take to the
streets for being "hurt" when the koran is analysed and evaluated in a scholarly
work, the christians take to the court and the media when their bible and their
chruch documents are exposed, and the vaishnavas (isckon variety) whine about
being hurt when faced with the daunting task of refuting others with reason and
intellect.

i add that true faith is the one that is founded on and acid-tested by reason
and logic, and not that which shuns reason and logic. the moment a creed or a
cult positions reason and faith as antithetical and excludes one to propagate
the other, that creed/ cult ceases to be *Dharmic*.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: yes (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 10:37AM

It seems we have gone off on a tangent.. can someone please help me with the below:


1. In regards to Mool Mantar, how does one go about deciding which one is the correct one, till now I have been doing up till Gurprasad but the older sampardas do till Nanak hosee bhee sach... because of this I do both Mool Mantars as I dont know which one we are supposed to do... HELP!

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Jagjit Singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 24, 2008 02:52PM

I have scan copies of 3 handwritten Mool mantars by Guru Sahibaan. One is by Sahib Siri Guru Tegh Bhahadhur ji, another by Siri Guru Hargobind Ji, and lastly one by Sahib Siri Guru Har Rai Ji.

All of them are up to Gurprasad.

One God: Waheguru
One Guru : Sahib Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
One Group : Guru Khalsa Panth!

This should be the Motto of Our Generation

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: 00Singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 25, 2008 02:54AM

I have been told by the Guru Roop Panj Piare that Mool Mantr is up until Gurprasad. Anything after that up to "Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach" is Maha Mantr.

Bhul Chuk Maaf.

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: khalistan_zindabaad (IP Logged)
Date: January 25, 2008 05:05AM

The three scanned copies do not state that it is mool mantr, are they larevaar?

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Jagjit Singh (IP Logged)
Date: January 25, 2008 02:24PM

If they start at Ik Onkar and finish at Gurprasad, then I think they are mool manter. It is funny that you would even question that.

It goes to show how a mind sometimes does not accept what is there, but tries to force something to be something else just to satisfy pre-determined theories, regardless of how inaccurate they maybe.

Most of their original copies are in the Sikh Reference library, Amritsar.

One God: Waheguru
One Guru : Sahib Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
One Group : Guru Khalsa Panth!

This should be the Motto of Our Generation

 



Re: Bhai Sahib views on various
Posted by: Khalsaspirit (IP Logged)
Date: January 25, 2008 08:02PM

Waheguru ji ka khalsa
Waheguru ji ki fateh

Abhiyaasee jio,

"daas has a gutkaa printed by taksal and harjug..." That is Mehta Taksal gutka.

The Gutka Sahib printed by Bhindra Taksal Giani Mohan Singh jee the Rehraas Starts from

"Dukh Daroo Sukh Rog Bhaia ---- to ---- Jis simrat Sukh hoi saglay DooKh jai"

Which is exactly same what most jathaybandian does and also by many Singhs (male/female) we met. The only minor difference is of Choupai Sahib. Here we do not understand why some people make issue of anything.

Mehta Taksal Gutka added that Har jug jug. There is also another interesting thing in between Bhindra Taksal Choupai version and Mehta Taksal Choupai version. Mehta changed the numbering system to one after many dohras in their early printings compare to Bhindra version which kept the ascending order up to 12 untill choupai ends and now in new versions suddenly they changed back to Bhindra version numbering system. So different taksals have their own versions for many things. Overall there are differences of reading of few Banis in almost every jathaybandi for Rehraas. Some of Singhs even in our families read full Anand sahib instead of 6 pauris. They never argued with others who read 6 pauri only. We think it is matter of personal choice or sharda if someone want to read more bani then read more bani but do not compel others for no reason.

What we conclude is that Rehraas from "Dukh Daroo Sukh Rog --- to --- Saglay dookh jai" is widely accepted and in between some read longer Choupai but shorter Anand sahib, some read shorter Choupai but longer Anand Sahib, some read both longer and some read both shorter. So, having said that it is meaning less to argue over Rehrass.

Guru Mehar Karay

Waheguru ji ka khalsa
Waheguru ji ki fateh

 
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