ਚੁਕਾਰਅਜ਼ਹਮਹਹੀਲਤੇਦਰਗੁਜ਼ਸ਼ਤ॥ਹਲਾਲਅਸਤਬੁਰਦਨਬਸ਼ਮਸ਼ੀਰਦਸਤ॥੨੨॥ (ਸ੍ਰੀ ਮੁਖਵਾਕ ਪਾਤਿਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦॥)

Akal Purakh Kee Rachha Hamnai, SarbLoh Dee Racchia Hamanai


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The tapoban nitnem
Posted by: singhstah (IP Logged)
Date: October 03, 2007 12:21PM

So far I've only been able to listen to (With guroo jis kirpa) the jap ji sahib recording on this site, when i have time on the weekend or something id like to listen to the rest. Great recordings, read with alot of pyaar, but was just wondering about the pronounciation different in there, at the "Akhan Zor chupai nai zor", first time I had ever heard Jor pronounced with a 'Z', I was curious as to why? Did bhai sahib write anything on gurbani pronounciation, i hope with kirpa that i too can start pronouncing gurbani the way father Guroo Ji would want, and i was pretty sure Gurdvara Tapoban Sahib would be doing the right/ closest way.
Thanks

 



Re: The tapoban nitnem
Posted by: kulbir singh (IP Logged)
Date: October 04, 2007 06:47AM

While pronunciation is very important but the most important aspect of doing paath is Bisraams and correct padd-chhed. Without understanding Gurbani, one cannot place correct bisraams (pause) or do correct padd-chhed. For this reason, its important to take santhiya from a Gursikh who is well-versed in doing paath.

As for pronouncing the z sound in Zor, we need to realise that Gurbani has three kind of words:

1) Original Gurmukhi or Punjabi words. These are pronounced as their original form in Punjabi.

2) Foreign words but that have become part of the local language. Such words if wished for, can be pronounced as their Punjabi version e.g. Qurbani, Zor etc. Q in Qurbani is not same as Kakka of Punjabi but in Urdu Kaaf and Q (alphabet with 2 nuktay on top) are pronounced differently but in Punjabi they are the same because Qurbani has become a Punjabi word now. Same way, the word Zor is okay to be pronounced as jor because this word has become a Punjabi word, though its roots are foreign (Persian).

3) Foreign words that have not become part of everyday Punjabi language e.g. "Zan" meaning woman should not be pronounced as Jan. Zan Pisar Pidar Biradara - In this sentence, this word should be pronounced as Zan. Jan with Jajja means servant, and Zan means woman. Same way the word "Jan" in "Mata Kheevi Nek Zan, jiss bahuti chhayo patraali" should be pronounced as "Zan" meaning Bibi, woman and not as "Jan" which is a masculine word meaning servant. The pankiti means "Mata Kheevi (wife of Siri Guru Angad Dev jee" is a very pious woman and she is like a shadow of a huge tree with great many leaves(giving coolness in hot weather)."

Having said that above, words in item 2 can be pronounced in their original form as in the case of Zor. Urdu speaking or ones who have read Urdu cannot say Jor. They naturally say Zor. So its fine to say Zor.

Daas,
Kulbir Singh

 



Re: The tapoban nitnem
Posted by: Singh. (IP Logged)
Date: October 05, 2007 08:15AM

If Zor is to be pronounced the proper Persian way, then it is as Zoor, not Zor.

 



Re: The tapoban nitnem
Posted by: singhstah (IP Logged)
Date: October 05, 2007 11:56AM

hmm i see, thats really interesting, so as long as meaning isnt changed it makes no difference,but in foriegn words it does so you do have to say it differently, yeah makes sense
I dont really have time at the moment for proper santhiya as I'm a full time student, however I have heard of something written by Bhai Randhir Singh Ji, I was hoping I could get some tips from that, not really sure though, does anyone know the name and where u can get it?

 



Re: The tapoban nitnem
Posted by: australiansingh (IP Logged)
Date: October 12, 2007 02:51PM

if gurbani is not pronounced this way.... it changes the meanings...

in gurbani Jor and Zor has different meanings and so is its pronounciation.

for example

Koi Jan Har Syon Devai Jor (Here jor means Jorna....)

then

Zor na mangan den naa Zor (Here Zor means force)

Same is with Jaat and Zaat.......

gurbani has few shabads where we pronounce Jaat (Jaanaaa) where as Zaat should be pronounced where ever it meantions about Caste..

 





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